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[09:32:06] <xnyhps> Hey, I've got a question about https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6120#section-4.8.2. It mentions: "the content namespace MUST be the same for the initial stream and the response stream so that both streams are qualified consistently" Yet in the examples in 9.2.1 and 9.2.2 use 'http://etherx.jabber.org/streams' as the content namespace of the responding stream, which doesn't match the initial stream. Is the example wrong, or am I missing something?
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[09:34:05] <Zash> ^^
[09:34:23] <xnyhps> Is in the example the responding stream using "prefix-free canonicalization"?
[09:35:16] <Zash> That's what it looks like
[09:35:40] <ermine> dwd: hi, can client send to server stream:error?
[09:36:16] <Kev> xnyhps: Looks that way.
[09:36:16] <Kev> ermine: Yes.
[09:36:31] <xnyhps> That's allowed?
[09:36:57] <xnyhps> The sentence I quoted seems to imply that the responder should also use a content namespace when the initiator did.
[09:37:35] <Kev> xnyhps: Yes, indeed, the quote suggests a bug in the spec.
[09:37:36] <ermine> Kev: any client implementation does it?
[09:37:49] <Kev> ermine: I would imagine so.
[09:38:06] <Kev> I think we probably do, even.
[09:38:57] <ermine> in psi?
[09:39:08] <Kev> Swift.
[09:40:08] <Kev> Although I can't immediately see it at the moment.
[09:40:42] <ermine> Kev: but how server should interpret client's stream:error? Silently closing stream and reporting to server's developers?
[09:41:19] <Kev> Well, it's not really silently closing the stream - if the client sends a stream:error it's because the client wants to close the stream.
[09:41:54] <Kev> I can't see where Swift does it, although I thought we did (on invalid XML, for example).
[09:42:24] <xnyhps> I'm also not sure how the responder can determine (ignoring port numbers) wether the incoming stream is s2s or c2s when the initiator is using prefix-free canonicalization. Check if the from is included and a FQDN?
[09:43:18] <Kev> xnyhps: You can only use port numbers. I don't like this prefix-free stuff at all. I don't know how I didn't realise how horrible it was when I was reviewing the RFCs pre-publishing.
[09:43:19] <Zash> In theory, that shouldn't be needed
[09:43:37] <Kev> I hope for 6120bis we can drop it and go back to the sane approach!
[09:44:21] <Kev> Zash: No? Don't you offer different features to clients and servers?
[09:44:36] <Zash> Offer all features to everyone?
[09:44:46] <xnyhps> I'm asking all this because I started using a streaming XML library that I later found out doesn't support opening tags with both a prefix and an xmlns.
[09:45:19] <Kev> xnyhps: I think you need to find a better library :)
[09:45:50] <xnyhps> A traditional stream header (not prefix-free) doesn't include the jabber:client or jabber:server.
[09:46:02] <xnyhps> Yeah, opened a bug with the author already.
[09:47:27] <Zash> Kev: You would know for sure after authentication, no?
[09:47:42] <Kev> Yes, after authentication.
[09:48:06] <Kev> Actually, I'm fibbing.
[09:48:14] <Kev> You know initially, because of the 'from' on the stream header.
[09:50:17] <Zash> There's that
[09:56:55] <dwd> Only if people are sending a from.
[09:57:27] <Kev> Oh, do I misremember? I thought that was mandatory on S2S.
[09:57:39] <dwd> Yes, it is.
[09:58:01] <dwd> And if people are doing all the mandatory things, then yes, they'll also be including a from attribute.
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[10:24:57] <ermine> Kev: do you know why in rfc6120 there is no invalid-id stream:error in Chapter 4?
[10:28:45] <ermine> it could be between 4.9.9 and 4.9.10
[10:28:45] <ermine> heh
[10:54:44] <xnyhps> Heh, testing prefix-free canonicalization: Prosody pretends you're using jabber:client, but doesn't also reply prefix-free. ejabberd replies with invalid-namespace, M-Link with bad-format.
[10:56:32] <xnyhps> OpenFire doesn't respond at all.
[10:58:37] <Zash> xnyhps: Our stream-opening code hard-codes that :/
[10:58:52] <Zash> And the parser does not expose it to us.
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[11:00:41] <xnyhps> The port multiplexing formats also look like they would break
[11:01:10] <Zash> Yes
[11:01:40] <Zash> .
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[11:09:39] <Kev_> Did I mention that prefix-free is a terribly silly idea?
[11:14:57] <xnyhps> No disagreement here.
[11:16:33] <dwd> It'd be equally OK if we asked for a stream application attribute, so that prefix-free could be allowed, but you'd declare the stream's application explicitly.
[11:16:52] <dwd> <stream:stream xmlns='...' application='jabber:client'?
[11:21:45] <xnyhps> That sounds like a good idea to me.
[11:24:55] <Kev_> Just not doing it seems like a good idea to me :)
[11:37:00] <dwd> The reason is exists at all is because in pure XML terms, it shouldn't matter when a namespace is declared.
[11:37:13] <dwd> xnyhps, By "M-Link" you mean jabber.org, right?
[11:37:56] <xnyhps> Yeah. And by "ejabberd" I meant pidgin.im and "Prosody" xnyhps.nl. So might not all be latest versions.
[11:38:52] <dwd> Right. Pretty sure newer M-Links will understand it. (Though I'm nothing to do with it anymore, of course).
[11:50:35] <Kev_> dwd: Understand prefix-free? Not as far as I know.
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[14:29:50] <Philonous> xnyhps: I haven't had problem with prefix free canonicalization on a locally running ejabberd.
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