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[11:13:49] <> Hey!
[11:13:59] <> I came across this quote: https://twitter.com/lvh/status/410341081876668416
[11:14:10] <> "Public service ann.: TLSv1_METHOD probably doesn't mean what you think it means. You want SSLv23_METHOD with OP_NO_SSLv2 | OP_NO_SSLv3."
[11:16:14] <> Now, I was wondering if and how that applies to XMPP. With SSLv23_METHOD, you have a SSLv2 hello, and then select which protocol versions you don't want to support.
[11:17:07] <> Why do you want the SSLv2 hello?
[11:17:08] <> However, with TLSv1_METHOD, you send a TLSv1 hello, and support only TLSv1 (and not higher)
[11:18:15] <> There's no way (in OpenSSL) that allows you to say you want TLSv1 *and* higher without using SSLv23_METHOD and thus SSL hellos.
[11:18:22] <> (If I understand correctly)
[11:18:31] <> That's correct.
[11:18:40] <> xnyhps: so is this a problem?
[11:18:56] <> xnyhps: what do you recommend here?
[11:19:04] <> If you set SSLv23, but OP_NO_SSLv2, you won't do a SSLv2 compatible handshake.
[11:19:28] <> Sorry, I mean, that's almost correct. :)
[11:19:32] <> xnyhps: so you agree with the "service announcement"?
[11:19:42] <> Yes.
[11:20:01] <> I wonder how many implementations do this correctly then.
[11:20:18] <> It's a pretty confusing situation, I've seen Mercurial do it wrong at some point.
[11:20:46] <> ralphm: Well, "Correctly". Neither is technically wrong, from my reading of the above.
[11:22:34] <> Mercurial enabled "SSLv3_METHOD", assuming it would enable SSLv3 and above. But that did actually disable TLS 1.0 and above.
[11:22:48] <> right
[11:23:21] <> Kev: I am wondering which implementations use TLSv1_METHOD and will not be able to interact with TLS > 1.0 entities
[11:23:40] <> I was also reminded of this: http://twistedmatrix.com/trac/ticket/3463
[11:24:12] <> Kev: and also, if they do use SSLv23_METHOD, do they disable SSLv2 and SSLv3?
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[11:24:40] <> Well, disabling v3 and v2 are somewhat different.
[11:25:04] <> In Twisted, again, the default implementation, that is used by Wokkel, only uses OP_NO_SSLv2
[11:25:06] <> v2 needs to be disabled. v3 is still in fairly widespread use, and isn't significantly worse than TLS1, as I understand it.
[11:25:26] <> Kev: sure, I am looking at this with xnyhps prose in mind.
[11:25:41] <> So SSLv23_METHOD + OP_NO_SSLv2 is probably reasonable.
[11:25:49] <> Speaking from my position of ignorance :)
[11:25:57] <> If we would want to upgrade to TLSv1.1 and beyond, this may be an issue?
[11:26:11] <> (using TLSv1_METHOD, that is)
[11:28:00] <> I suspect you'll just have to treat the SSLv23_METHOD identifier as an opaque string, and not think about the meaning behind it. This seems more like an API naming bug in OpenSSL than anything.
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[11:28:55] <> waqas: I'm not talking about the name.
[11:29:06] <> (that indeed was a sad choice)
[11:29:57] <> waqas: I'm talking about if there are implementations that do TLSv1_METHOD, and if so, can we detect this. Because I suspect this will be an issue *later*.
[11:31:53] <> Detecting it externally would be imperfect. Such an implementation would only support TLS1.0, and nothing else. But you'll get that in e.g., Ubuntu (Ubuntu was the one where TLS1.1 and 1.2 were not compiled in by default?) when the admin disables SSLv2 and v3.
[11:32:19] <> I suspect from outside both these cases would look the same.
[11:32:28] <> (only in the client)
[11:33:01] <> waqas: so this was really my questions. Do the hellos differ if you use TLSv1_METHOD or SSLv23_METHOD with <1.0 disabled.
[11:33:17] <> (giventhat TLS > 1.0 are not compiled in)
[11:33:57] <> I'm guessing that they don't differ, but that's a wild guess without any evidence, so ignore me :)
[11:34:23] <> xnyhps: Tell us!
[11:34:48] <> I also note this ticket by Simon: https://github.com/node-xmpp/node-xmpp/issues/192
[11:35:13] <> I think the hellos are the same.
[11:36:01] <> In fact, I think I even saw that the TLSv1_METHOD hello and the SSLv23_METHOD with only SSLv2 disabled had the same hello.
[11:36:25] <> xnyhps: ok.
[11:37:04] <> well, given that Twisted ticket above, about issues connecting to GTalk, I *suspect* that most client implementations do SSLv23_METHOD anyway.
[11:37:30] <> (there's a similar one for Gajim: https://trac.gajim.org/ticket/3786)
[11:38:58] <> xmpp.net has 29 servers where only TLS 1.0 is supported.
[11:40:04] <> xnyhps: but that's the receiving side, yes?
[11:40:11] <> Yes.
[11:43:41] <> Hmm, I think Twisted actually uses TLSv1_METHOD anyway.
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[16:39:32] <> it seems there're a lot of servers out there which just accept dialback but don't advertise its support...
[16:39:54] <> /me found a few versions of ejabberd doing that and also MU Conference.
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[19:02:06] <> oh, nice. missing info in MUC schema
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