Logs for jdev

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[18:18:55] <Lance> psa: Alex may know more, but are the voting input/result file formats able to change, or are there other tools dependent on them?
[18:19:35] <psa> Lance: we have scripts that take the output files and perform counting etc.
[18:20:02] <Lance> ok, that's what I needed to know. I'll keep those the same then
[18:20:04] <Lance> thanks
[18:20:40] <psa> no, thank you
[18:35:08] <Tobias> psa, you don't know any SRTP guys, do you?
[18:35:17] <psa> I might :)
[18:35:25] <Tobias> other than emcho? :)
[18:35:31] <psa> yes, other than emcho
[18:35:40] <psa> he's more of a ZRTP guy anyway
[18:35:45] <Tobias> ahh..yeah
[18:36:44] <Tobias> wondering if there's a key agreement protocol for maintaining a shared key between all participants in a group, with people joining/leaving
[18:37:02] <psa> oh
[18:37:27] <psa> SRTP for group comms? I don't know of a key agreement protocol that people use for that, but it's a hard problem, I think
[18:38:25] <Tobias> emcho said most implementation do group comm by just having n dedicated 1-to-1 contexts
[18:38:35] <Tobias> but this gets quite expensive as n increases
[18:41:32] <psa> /me sends a pointed reply on the simple@ietf.org list, in response to this statement...
[18:41:35] <psa> "XMPP has this problem. The XMPP server is not aware of the presence, it just routes stanzas. Without caching stanzas or doing something else, it is just not possible to create an API into the server and get the presence of a particular JID. In SIP the server aggregates the presence and is aware of it, so we can send SUBSCRIBE with expire:0 and query for presence. Thus, we can integrate into an address book more easily from a SIP presence server."
[18:42:49] <Tobias> hä? the server not aware of presence?
[18:42:50] <psa> and my reply: "Olle, that statement has no basis in reality. Every XMPP server implementation on the planet is aware of the presence state for each Jabber ID under its control."
[18:43:23] <psa> Tobias: these are SIP guys, they don't necessarily know about XMPP, but if they don't know then they shouldn't make statements with no basis in reality :)
[18:43:24] <psa> brb
[18:43:28] <Lance> sure, you could make a server that's not presence aware. but then it wouldn't be following spec
[18:44:04] <Tobias> psa, hey i don't blame them...i usually spread the word that SIP is nothing else than bad executed HTTP over UDP :P
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[18:44:59] <Tobias> psa, don't servers even have to have awareness of JID presence beyond their scope of control for PEP?
[18:51:02] <psa> Tobias: yes, in order to respond to presence probes, of course
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