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[08:24:31] <ayman.77> بدف
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[09:18:18] <vminko> hello dudes
[09:18:25] <vminko> what's going on with jabber.org
[09:18:37] <vminko> i cant receive messages from other clients
[09:18:49] <vminko> and i see them as offline
[09:19:05] <vminko> but they can read my messages
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[09:37:48] <vminko> guys
[09:37:53] <vminko> please fix the server
[09:42:45] <Tobias> vminko, if that error continue I'd recommend dropping a short mail describing the problem to the server admin
[09:44:50] <vminko> Tobias: jadmin@jabber.org?
[09:48:11] * Kev joined the chat.
[09:48:48] <Tobias> vminko, mail to stpeter@jabber.org should work if nobody is here. would be nice if you make sure it's jabber.org's fault :)
[09:48:58] <Kev> vminko: Get a protocol log and send it to stpeter/jabber.org with a cc: kevin/kismith.co.uk please. We'll investigate.
[09:49:27] <vminko> how to get the log?
[09:49:32] <vminko> i use pidgin im
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[09:52:00] <vminko> There's a debug window
[09:52:10] <Kev> That's the one, I *think*.
[09:52:16] <vminko> It generates some kind of log
[09:52:17] <vminko> http://codepad.org/PZ8ZaGHW
[09:52:22] <vminko> here's an example
[09:53:05] <Kev> That shows you receiving messages from your contacts.
[09:53:05] <Tobias> yeah...that'd be helpful
[09:53:14] <Tobias> g2g..cya
[09:53:20] <vminko> but that's another server
[09:53:23] <vminko> jabber.ru
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[09:54:28] <Kev> OK - if you can get session logs for both you and the contact that's unable to send messages to you, and send them to the
mail addresses above, I'll take a look at this.
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[10:48:27] <nn2> hi
[10:48:35] <Kev> Hello.
[10:48:50] <nn2> did you find out anything about the offline message setting?
[10:49:14] <nn2> //did you get the JID?
[10:50:06] <Kev> I've checked that the offline setting should be active for anyone that doesn't opt-out of it.
[10:50:32] <Kev> If you sent me a JID to check by mail, I'm afraid my inbox is growing rather than shrinking at the moment and I've not got
to it.
[10:51:13] <nn2> i sent a message to stpeter for forwarding to you
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[10:51:33] <nn2> probably got lost or so
[10:51:49] <Kev> Using stpeter as a relay is potentially laggy, he's very busy.
[10:51:54] <nn2> heh
[10:52:05] <nn2> can you see JIDs of people in here?
[10:52:21] <Kev> I can.
[10:52:26] <nn2> ok...
[10:57:40] <nn2> will be here in about 15 minutes
[11:00:16] <Kev> I'll probably be out for lunch then.
[11:04:46] <nn2> (then later on or so)
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[11:04:59] <yofel> there
[11:05:19] <nn2> Kev: ^
[11:05:20] <yofel> nn2, Kev
[11:05:24] <yofel> :)
[11:14:23] <nn2> (the question was if accounts created before the migration to m-link (since that one introduced the setting (?)) got "Store
messages received while offline" enabled by default, too)
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[14:49:45] <adams37190> charlucbe@jabber.org
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[15:25:20] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Hey guys :) Anyone able to answer some questions about transports, e.g. ICQ and stuff?
[15:29:37] <naw> branislav.bardak@jabber.org: what questions?
[15:33:00] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> naw, well, like, what the cons and pros are as opposed to a multi-protocol client who can speak ICQ natively for example
[15:33:17] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> I think I really misunderstood the whole transports-concept from the beginning
[15:34:10] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Reading about it the first time I thought I could use my ICQ-Account over a single Jabber-ID, same with chatting to ppl on
other XMPP-Networks like Facebook, GTalk etc.
[15:34:44] <naw> the transports are components that run on a jabber server, they connect to your icq/msn/whatever account and displays your
icq contacts as jabber contacts
[15:36:00] <naw> I think that multiprotcol clients probably are more developed
[15:36:09] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Ok, I got that so far, but e.g. jabber.org doesn't support transports, so, I need another jabber-Account on a server that
supports Transports, right?
[15:36:30] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Which in turn means: Two Jabber-Accounts and storing Login-Information for e.g. my ICQ Account on the 2nd Jabber-Server
[15:36:52] <naw> no, you don't, you can use transports from other servers, though some server admins block users from other servers
[15:36:59] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> If I got that right, than I don't see the benefit as opposed to a multi-protocol-client having my ICQ-Account directly in
it
[15:37:56] <naw> the benefit is that you only need a client that supports jabber (and developers doesn't need to implement all those protocols)
[15:39:22] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Yeah, from a developers point of view of course ^^
[15:39:39] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> But from a user perspective I don't see any benefits so far, if I got everything right that is ^^
[15:40:23] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Especially storing login information on the Jabber server that supports the protocol causes me some headaches
[15:41:07] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> If I want to chat to a GTalk-Account, do I need a GTalk-Account as well? Since both are XMPP services, no?
[15:41:46] <naw> xmpp servers are almost always interconnected so you don't need a gtalk account
[15:42:16] <naw> it works like when you send an email fom otmail to gmail
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[15:43:13] <naw> by the way, facebook has just an xmpp "interface" so you can not talk with them from other servers
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[15:44:01] <qwemre\40jabber.org> hello
[15:44:19] <naw> hello
[15:44:24] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Yeah, that's how I understood it in the first place when reading about it, being decentralized and all this, but then I tried
to send messages to other services, like one called "studivz.de" or "meinvz.de", kind of a german facebook, and it requires
you to have an account on their servers, even though their chat is implemented in XMPP. That's why I'm confused and not sure
I understood it all right.
[15:44:25] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Ho
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[15:45:26] <qwemre\40jabber.org> May I ask Bise
[15:45:45] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> What's the difference between a service implementing an XMPP interface (Facebook) and GTalk then?
[15:47:43] <qwemre\40jabber.org> I did register the bot does not work
[15:47:45] <naw> first of all, the server admins can disable the server to server communications, so their server won't be federated
in the case of facebook, they allow to connect to their internal chat system (which is not xmpp, as far I know) using xmpp
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[15:48:06] <naw> they alllow it translating from xmpp to their protocol
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[15:49:53] <qwemre\40jabber.org> can you help me I am Turk
[15:50:24] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> So, an XMPP Interface is like a transport, only that the translation happens on the other server (foreign server with interface
vs. jabber server with transport)
[15:51:26] <qwemre\40jabber.org> yardım plis
[15:52:22] <naw> branislav.bardak@jabber.org: correct, at least it is how I believe that facebook works
[15:52:36] <naw> I had read about it time ago...
[15:53:24] <Kev> branislav.bardak@jabber.org: There are transports that look like XMPP servers over C2S too, instead of over S2S.
[15:53:26] <qwemre\40jabber.org> k bot neden çalışmıyor
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[15:56:22] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> I see. Seems that it's more complicated than I thought. I thought you could have one Account and every service that offers
an XMPP implementation could be used with a single Account. That's how I imagined it when I first read about it
[15:57:00] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Like in the example of Facebook, no need to create a facebook account but just the need to know the facebook usernames I want
to chat with (like emails)
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[16:03:01] <Kev> branislav.bardak@jabber.org: This is correct, with the exception of Facebook, which only offers partial XMPP.
[16:03:24] <Kev> Using your account 'branislav.bardak@jabber.org' you are able to talk to any federated XMPP service - which is pretty much
all the public ones apart from Facebook.
[16:04:29] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Yeah, that's what I have read, like a P2P network sharing the same protocol. All nodes interconnected. Or IP and Routers.
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[16:05:36] <Kev> Email's a reasonable facsimile.
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[16:09:13] <acayla.murphy@gmail.com/Meebo> hey
[16:09:18] <acayla.murphy@gmail.com/Meebo> chat with me
[16:12:53] <acayla.murphy@gmail.com/Meebo> what
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[16:43:21] <hayes43619> hello
[16:44:22] <hayes43619> Using your account 'branislav.bardak@jabber.org' you are able to talk to any federated XMPP service - which is pretty much
all the public ones apart from Facebook. <<--Does that mean I can't use jabber to communicate with facebook?
[16:45:45] <Kev> You can't use your jabber.org account to talk to facebook, they don't federate with the rest of the network.
[16:46:00] <Kev> You can use an XMPP client to connect to Facebook if you have a facebook account and want to talk only to Facebook users.
[16:49:52] <hayes43619> too bad
[16:50:13] <hayes43619> I want to talk to Facebook users without a facebook account
[16:50:35] <hayes43619> Is gmail federated? Is there anywhere I can get a list of federated services?
[16:51:52] <Kev> Yes, gmail's federated.
[16:55:43] <louiz’> most are federated. Facebook is a rare exception
[16:56:09] <Kev> Indeed. There are others that aren't federated, but we're usually talking about enterprise or government environments.
[17:03:04] <hayes43619> oh i should've known gmail is federated, I made an account just to talk to one friend! So is it as simple to add a gmail contact
via empathy using a jabber account?
[17:04:29] <Kev> You just add myfriend@gmail.com instead of myotherfriend@jabber.org or whatever.
[17:05:37] <louiz’> yes, gmail.com is like any other jabber server
[17:05:42] <louiz’> (accept for its bugs)
[17:07:27] <hayes43619> thanks for the info I was getting really confused
[17:07:47] <hayes43619> and thanks for the attention
[17:07:58] <hayes43619> one last question (a little bit offtopic)
[17:08:11] <hayes43619> do you know if it is possible to close a gmail account?
[17:08:49] <louiz’> no idea, but I doubt that’s impossible
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[17:25:43] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Hey guys, thx so far the talk, I think things are a bit clearer now.
[17:26:28] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Just one thing, I can't use the transports of one server from my jabber.org account without registering on that other server
that supports transports, right?
[17:26:41] <Kev> In principle this is not true.
[17:26:45] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> So, in effect, I'll have to be logged in with two accounts at least al the time.
[17:27:00] <Kev> However some (or most, I do not know) server operators will restrict their transports to local users only.
[17:27:12] <Kev> It's a deployment decision, rather than a necessity of the protocol.
[17:27:42] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> I see, so it's like with Facebook, the decision if it's publicly available has to be done by the server operator offering
the XMPP server or Interface
[17:28:11] <Kev> Yes.
[17:28:49] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> So, if the other server allows it, I could use e.g. 123456789@icq.otherserver.org, or whatever their IDs look like
[17:29:05] <Kev> Having registered with icq.otherserver.org, yes.
[17:29:30] <Kev> Where registering in this case means telling them your ICQ account details so they can do the transporting for you.
[17:30:01] <branislav.bardak@jabber.org> Ok, that's clear so far.
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[19:18:23] <hayes43619> will xmpp be one day as common as email is?
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[20:37:28] <aboody> HI
[20:37:52] <aboody> :-D
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[22:04:32] <quincyadams33466> hi
[22:04:40] * quincyadams33466 in now known as visita.
[22:04:55] <visita> how u been
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[22:06:39] <michaelsog> hi
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[22:08:35] <waser> hi people!
[22:10:08] <visita> hi waser
[22:10:13] <waser> how are you?
[22:10:14] <michaelsog> hi waser
[22:10:17] <michaelsog> im fine
[22:10:21] <michaelsog> you?
[22:10:26] <waser> I am ok, kindda new to all this
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[22:10:33] <michaelsog> me too
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[22:10:54] <visita> /list
[22:10:55] <waser> cool, at least I am not alone :P
[22:11:03] <michaelsog> yup
[22:11:06] <waser> not*
[22:11:18] <waser> damn, my Ts look like Ls
[22:11:25] <waser> damn font
[22:12:06] <michaelsog> I'm trying to find more rooms
[22:12:09] <michaelsog> with people
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[22:12:22] <waser> yeah, I found tons of rooms, but they are all empty
[22:12:36] <michaelsog> yup
[22:12:41] <michaelsog> this is the only one with people
[22:12:44] <waser> but I am still an IRC guy tho
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[22:13:20] <michaelsog> I've a question, maybe someone here can answer me, can I join another jabber conference server with my account ?
[22:13:35] <waser> that I don't know
[22:13:40] <waser> but I guess it is possible
[22:14:00] <waser> btw, I added you to my contact list, if you don't mind
[22:14:39] <michaelsog> ok
[22:15:08] <waser> thanks
[22:16:11] <michaelsog> where're you from?
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[22:16:32] <waser> Canada, you?
[22:17:21] <michaelsog> mexico
[22:17:25] <waser> oh cool
[22:17:48] <waser> how old are you?
[22:20:04] <michaelsog> 25
[22:21:11] <waser> ok
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