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[02:40:06] <hei\40jabber.org> hello
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[10:25:14] <louiz’> Could a XEP letting a component retrieve someone's roster from the server be conceivable?
[10:25:39] <MattJ> Talk to HanzZ :)
[10:25:44] <louiz’> Because, currently, for exemple, a PubSub component cannot implement the Roster permission model
[10:25:54] <MattJ> He's working on exactly that kind of thing (trusted components)
[10:26:04] <louiz’> ok, nice
[10:26:57] <Kev> Although you don't need a XEP for this.
[10:27:06] <Kev> The protocol's already defined in 3921bis.
[10:27:12] <louiz’> oh ?
[10:27:16] <MattJ> Exactly, Prosody already allows it when configured correctly :)
[10:27:29] <MattJ> but the XEP is for the user to decide which components to allow access
[10:27:30] <louiz’> how so?
[10:27:35] <louiz’> and where in 3921bis?
[10:27:38] <MattJ> for e.g. remote components
[10:27:41] <Kev> louiz’: You just do an iq:roster to the user's bare JID. Same as for your own roster.
[10:27:48] <Kev> MattJ: Right, I know this.
[10:28:11] <louiz’> Kev, yeah, but can a component authenticate?
[10:28:25] <MattJ> louiz’, it already authenticates
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[10:28:39] <Kev> I think that's just a configuration option for the server. It already authenticates as itself.
[10:28:44] <louiz’> but, no, like To say "I'm asking that on the behalf of nick@server"
[10:28:55] <MattJ> louiz’, why does it matter?
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[10:29:30] <louiz’> Humù, yeah, you're right, the user would just need to prove himself to the component
[10:29:37] <louiz’> since the component is trusted by the server. Right
[10:30:01] <louiz’> Link Mauve, ↑
[10:30:22] <MattJ> I'm sure I've already had this conversation with Link Mauve :)
[10:30:29] <Kev> My previous comment was nonsense, please disregard.
[10:30:52] <louiz’> MattJ, that's a possibility, yes :p
[10:30:53] <Link Mauve> Which one?
[10:31:02] <Kev> The user has to tell their server that the component is allowed to do an iq:roster get, indeed, which is what HanzZ's protoXEP will say.
[10:31:07] <Link Mauve> Oh, the roster to component? Right.
[10:31:10] <louiz’> yes
[10:31:30] <Kev> For local users you can simply have it as a server configuration option.
[10:31:44] <louiz’> But, you'll need to use a trusted component, in this case. You cannot use any component
[10:31:52] <MattJ> Kev, well, in the current absence of such a XEP I think it's perfectly reasonable to allow the friendly server admin to set trusted components (usually they'd be local though)
[10:32:19] <Kev> MattJ: Although I think HanzZ has come around to my way of thinking now, and is working on the theory that the transport itself will be an iq:roster provider to the user, rather than the reverse.
[10:32:22] <MattJ> I mean, wanting to use external pubsub and give it access to rosters - usually this will be an admin decision, not a user one
[10:32:35] <Link Mauve> louiz’, I think it’s to the user to choose which components are to be trusted.
[10:32:40] <Kev> Yes, absolutely.
[10:32:44] <MattJ> Yes, that makes plenty of sense too - we could be talking about separate issues :)
[10:32:44] <Kev> (@MattJ)
[10:33:12] <louiz’> For example, my jid is "user@server1.tld" and I want to have a blog at "pubsub.blog_platform.tld", I cannot do that if blog_platform and server1 don't trust each others
[10:33:38] <louiz’> (I mean, if I want roster permissions)
[10:34:08] <Link Mauve> But if the user can say “I want to trust pubsub.blog_platform.tld” to the server, it’s possible.
[10:34:33] <louiz’> We would need something like "Hello, I'm blog_platform.tld and I need the user@server1.tld roster, here is his password for proof/whaterver"
[10:35:04] <louiz’> or yeah, tell our server that pubsub.blog_platform.tld is authorized to request the roster
[10:35:05] <Kev> No, quite the reverse, I think.
[10:35:08] <Kev> Yes, that.
[10:35:11] <louiz’> yep.
[10:35:52] <Link Mauve> The component never has to need user’s password, never!
[10:36:00] <louiz’> is that what HanzZ is working on?
[10:36:06] <louiz’> Link Mauve, yes, you're right
[10:36:18] <MattJ> louiz’, it was, Kev suggests maybe it isn't now
[10:36:28] <louiz’> ok
[10:36:34] <MattJ> since in HanzZ's case he wanted to modify the user's roster
[10:36:44] <louiz’> Link Mauve, write that XEP. :o
[10:36:46] <MattJ> and it's easier for the component to store its own roster
[10:44:20] <Link Mauve> So basically, this XEP should only permit to other entities (servers, components, perhaps even other users) to request user’s roster, but only if the user agree.
[10:45:14] <Link Mauve> So user’s server maintain a list of entities trusted by the admin, and a list per user.
[10:45:30] <Link Mauve> I think I can write such XEP. :)
[10:45:46] <Kev> HanzZ already wrote one, I remember editing it.
[10:46:48] <Link Mauve> I have read this one, but it was the user requesting roster from other servers, IIRC.
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[10:49:54] <Link Mauve> But for now, I have to go to school.
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[11:29:19] <deryni> The proto-xep that HanzZ wrote (at least the one I saw) had some somewhat fundamental issues, though they may all have been in the component editing cases and not the component viewing cases (I don't recall).
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[12:18:52] <louiz’> for what we are talking about, the component/server/user doesn't need to change the roster, just request it and receive roster push after that
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[12:27:11] <deryni> Right. My point was just that I don't remember if the issues I talked to HanzZ about affected that "level" of his proto-xep or not.
[12:27:50] <louiz’> ok
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[14:14:40] <xuwhisk> hi
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[16:02:07] <Florob> !xep thread
[16:02:23] <Florob> well, could've worked
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[16:03:17] <Kev> !xep thread
[16:03:19] <Kanchil> Kev: XEP-0201: Best Practices for Message Threads is Informational (Proposed, 2010-09-28) See: http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0201.html
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[21:17:49] <zash_> !ping zash.se
[21:21:00] <Kanchil> zash_: Ping failed (remote-server-not-found)
[21:21:28] <zash_> Zash: How can you still be here?
[21:22:42] <Florob> zanchin, he isn't
[21:22:49] <Florob> zanchin, soory
[21:23:13] <Florob> /me can't type any more :(
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[21:26:59] <johnny> http://phono.com/
[21:27:21] <johnny> "Phono also acts as an XMPP client capable of sending and receiving IM messages to and from any XMPP/Google Talk user
[21:27:33] <johnny> hmm..
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[21:30:37] <stpeter> johnny: interesting, I haven't heard of phono before
[21:30:59] <stpeter> sigh, my inbox is out of control
[21:31:33] <Tobias> to any US number, wow
[21:32:05] <stpeter> heh
[21:56:15] <johnny> stpeter, neither had I :)
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[21:56:42] <johnny> stpeter, i think you're beating yourself up by trying to keep to inbox 0 imo.. you're doing the job of too many people
[21:56:57] <johnny> that's what it seems like anyways
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[22:17:12] <louiz’> Well, his jdev@conference.jabber.org inbox is not empty: he didn't read what you said :p
[22:20:32] <johnny> louiz’, he can't keep up, that's the problem
[22:21:17] <louiz’> yes, he seems to be a busy man
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