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[09:27:51] <laibsch> Hello. I've been using a jabber.org and jabber.ccc.de ID for a while now. But I'd consider myself still wet behind the ears when it comes to Jabber. Most of my chat clients are on Yahoo, MSN and IRC. Can I interface to those accounts from Jabber? I tried messaging my own MSN account but that failed.
[09:29:01] <laibsch> I read http://www.jabberes.org/servers/ but I still cannot answer this question
[09:30:10] <laibsch> FWIW, I am using Pidgin because it supports most protocols out there (I hate the clutter)
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[09:58:53] <dmex> !Ping Kev
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[10:00:27] <dmex> just dropping by to let you guys know theres an invalid JID on the conference list that might require some attention: <item jid='@conference.jabber.org'/>
[10:01:08] <dmex> laibsch, pidgin wont help you use gateways to other networks btw
[10:02:50] <laibsch> dmex: IOW, jabber supports gateway'ing to other networks, but pidgin doesn't implement this feature?
[10:03:28] <laibsch> Is this what "transport" in jabber refers to?
[10:03:31] <laibsch> http://developer.pidgin.im/wiki/Protocol%20Specific%20Questions#DoesPidginsupportServiceDiscoveryorTransports
[10:04:13] <dmex> not very well no, you have to enable the service discovery option for a start than use the Tools > XMPP Service Discovery menu
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[10:05:40] <dmex> then if your server supports gateways, right-click the one you wish to use (mesenger/yahoo etc) and click register, fill out the form and ones its done, your contacts will show up on your contact list
[10:06:57] <laibsch> sounds fairly complicated ;-)
[10:07:01] <laibsch> I'll have a look
[10:07:04] <dmex> thats pidgin for you
[10:07:12] <laibsch> so far it served me well
[10:07:19] <laibsch> which client do you suggest for Ubuntu?
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[10:07:46] <dmex> the gateway handles the transport, you have to give it your user/pass and it does your contacts/messaging over xmpp
[10:08:10] <laibsch> "you have to enable the service discovery option"
[10:08:14] <laibsch> is that a compile-time option?
[10:08:19] <dmex> no
[10:08:22] <laibsch> OK
[10:08:28] <laibsch> /me goes looking for it
[10:08:48] <dmex> its on your plugin menu
[10:09:09] <dmex> Tools > Plugins > XMPP Service Discovery
[10:10:21] <laibsch> It's a plugin
[10:10:31] <laibsch> the plugin itself has to be enabled first, I think
[10:10:33] <laibsch> thanks
[10:12:18] <laibsch> I'm not sure I want to give out my passwords to strangers
[10:12:26] <laibsch> Maybe I should set up my own Jabber server
[10:12:28] <laibsch> ouch!
[10:13:27] <dmex> no one but you will know your password, but it depends on the server your using
[10:13:47] <laibsch> any server you recommend?
[10:14:02] <laibsch> the two I've been using so far don't seem to have gateways
[10:14:03] <dmex> neko.im is run by process one, Nyco in here is a dev there
[10:14:11] <laibsch> thanks
[10:14:25] <Kev> dmex: That's not true - if you use a transport, you give your password over to whoever runs the transport.
[10:14:31] <Kev> And I'm AFK, I'm afraid.
[10:14:54] <laibsch> I suspected this much
[10:15:21] <dmex> well I trust neko.im
[10:15:26] <laibsch> thanks for clarifying, Kev. Maybe I should run my own transport (which I assume is another word for "Jabber server that implements a gateway")
[10:16:34] <dmex> their devs are trusted by the community
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[10:22:03] <laibsch> nice. XMPP service discovery just crashed my pidgin. Seems like indeed that stuff is not well supported in pidgin.
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[10:38:38] <dmex> laibsch: I would try another client like psi
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[10:41:30] <laibsch> Thank you. I'll have a look.
[10:49:43] <Kev> dmex: That depends who you refer to as the community - I don't trust anyone with my passwords for other services.
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[10:52:30] <Kev> laibsch: If you have somewhere to run it, and you want to use transports, my preference is always running your own server and transports.
[10:52:37] <dmex> well I know the admins here trust them, also since they created ejabberd.
[10:52:44] <laibsch> I have a server that runs 24/7
[10:53:09] <dmex> Kev, Im here because theres an invalid jid being sent out from the conference gateway
[10:53:23] <laibsch> I wonder why it's been implemented the way it's been done. It seems like right now, you cannot get a secure solution client-side only
[10:53:50] <Kev> laibsch: If you want a secure client-side only you can have it, but it's connecting directly to the legacy network, rather than using XMPP.
[10:53:56] <Kev> That's just using Pidgin directly :)
[10:54:12] <laibsch> hehe
[10:54:17] <Kev> dmex: Which jid is that?
[10:54:21] <laibsch> I guess you understand what I meant
[10:54:55] <laibsch> I'm quite fed up with the account proliferation. so, if jabber was able to help me retire a few accounts I'd be more than happy.
[10:55:33] <Kev> laibsch: As long as the end services require a password, and you want to connect over xmpp, there's no way to avoid sending that password to the transport server.
[10:57:10] <laibsch> OK
[10:57:14] <laibsch> thank you for your help, guys
[10:57:16] <laibsch> going offline now
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[11:00:35] <dmex> Kev: the jid being sent out is @conference.jabber.org
[11:00:56] <Kev> Well that's interesting. Thanks.
[11:01:21] <dmex> its been there about three weeks, been meaning to drop in and let someone know
[11:01:33] <dmex> been busy working on my xmpp client ;)
[11:02:53] <Kev> Which was your client?
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[11:03:17] <dmex> Sharp Messenger
[11:04:02] <dmex> nothing up yet, still pre-alpha planning, http://sourceforge.net/p/sharpmessenger/home/
[11:04:13] <Kev> I just saw that.
[11:04:23] <Kev> What are the goals of this client?
[11:04:28] <dmex> myself and Alex from agsxmpp have been working on it
[11:04:52] <dmex> goals are standards compliant and feature complete
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[11:06:08] <dmex> beta stage Ill be working on portability to OSX and Linux
[11:06:37] <Kev> Isn't .Net a strange choice if you want cross platform support (OS X particularly)?
[11:06:42] <dmex> UI is similar to psi and Live Messenger 2011
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[11:06:55] <dmex> no not really, Mono runs on OSX
[11:07:11] <Kev> It does, but the GUIs don't work well, from what I remember.
[11:07:32] <dmex> Ive written custom controls for everything ;)
[11:07:40] <Kev> Does that help?
[11:07:46] <Kev> It'll still need to use GTK, won't it?
[11:08:18] <dmex> GTK would only be used for drawing, the routines are OS agnostic
[11:08:47] <Kev> Right, but that's still going to be a problem isn't it?
[11:08:53] <Kev> Given that GTK doesn't work natively on OS X.
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[11:09:41] <Kev> Ah, I see that there's "MonoMac" in development, so maybe you won't need to use the GTK bindings.
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[11:10:07] <dmex> Ill have to check it out at some stage, I dont have a apple machine handy, just some slow ass virtualbox install of osx
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[11:18:57] <dmex> Kev: you working on swift now?
[11:19:11] <Kev> Yes, I've not worked on Psi for over a year.
[11:20:01] <dmex> http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/7867/contactscontrol.png
[11:21:01] <Kev> What's that? :)
[11:21:11] <dmex> A 'friend' sent me the class ID's for drawing the Vista/Win7 explorer style theme
[11:21:28] <dmex> thats an early version of my roster control ;)
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[11:21:33] <Kev> Ah, a roster.
[11:21:37] <Kev> Yes, that makes sense.
[11:25:06] <dmex> if you wanted to use them with the swift roster, use the OpenThemeData/DrawThemebackground api's on windows, with the class "Explorer::TreeView" with the part/states 1/2 - 1/3 - 1/5 - 1/6 - 2/1 - 2/2 - 4/1 - 4/2
[11:25:37] <Kev> Thanks, but I don't at the moment :)
[11:25:44] <dmex> lol ;)
[11:26:02] <dmex> Ill make a feature request at some stage ;)
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[11:44:58] <dmex> Kev, Im actually seeing 4 malformed Jids in PSI from the conference gateway, not just the one
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[13:44:29] <art> hi all, are self-signed certificates for xmpp servers acceptable by default? I.e., to federate with google talk?
[13:45:21] <art> i know for example openfire can accept self-signed by default but not sure if this is now OK in general. Also, does the certificate need to match the reverse DNS
[13:45:53] <zanchin> art, yes you can federate with google with a self-signed cert
[13:46:21] <art> thanks zanchin, any idea about the reverse dns matching cert?
[13:47:03] <MattJ> No, reverse DNS is not used in XMPP
[13:48:01] <art> thanks mattj.
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[14:26:42] <Tanguy> As far as I know, reverse DNS is used nowhere with SSL.
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[16:41:55] * vanburen29541 in now known as Trev.
[16:42:45] <Trev> I'm wondering if this is the correct place to ask a question about speeqe and jabber/xmpp chat history in the room.
[16:43:00] <MattJ> Maybe :)
[16:43:33] <Trev> I'm trying to limit how much chat history is show in the room, preferrably by how "old" the chat stuff is.
[16:43:41] <Trev> If that makes sense.
[16:44:51] * Kev joined the chat.
[16:45:31] <MattJ> Sure, the client can request that it only gets messages within the past X seconds
[16:46:06] <Trev> Interesting, do you know where I might find that? I can't seem to find it anywhere.
[16:46:20] <Trev> Just in config?
[16:46:26] <MattJ> http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0045.html#enter-history
[16:46:34] <MattJ> If Speeqe doesn't support it then it would need to be added
[16:47:02] <Trev> Alright. I'm using turnkey-ejabberd, a supposed "out-of-box" solution.
[16:47:29] <MattJ> I think ejabberd supports the feature, but I'm not 100% sure
[16:47:43] <Trev> Alright, I'll poke around some more.
[16:47:48] <MattJ> It's a trivial to change to Speeqe if necessary
[16:47:58] <MattJ> once you locate the MUC joining code
[16:48:14] <Trev> What is trivial?
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[16:49:12] <MattJ> Adding the 'seconds' attribute
[16:49:55] <Trev> Oh, yeah, for sure. I found "muc.py" in /xmpp/, so I'll start there.
[16:50:55] <MattJ> I'd guess it would be a .js file
[16:51:15] <Trev> Yeah? Hmm.
[16:52:09] <MattJ> Try grepping for $presence
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[16:53:20] <MattJ> Ah, it's scripts/chat.js (in mine at least)
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[16:55:14] <MattJ> Do you see this line?:
[16:55:15] <MattJ> var x = Strophe.xmlElement("x", [["xmlns", "http://jabber.org/protocol/muc"]]);
[16:55:27] <MattJ> It's line 29 for me of scripts/chat.js
[16:57:07] <Trev> I found similar lines.
[16:57:25] <MattJ> "similar"?
[16:57:45] <Trev> I'm changing from a web shell to a normal shell so I can search for the entire line.
[16:57:49] <MattJ> ok
[16:58:06] <Trev> For example, I don't get http://jabber.org/protocol/muc but I get Jabber:something.
[16:59:11] <Trev> line not found.
[16:59:23] <MattJ> any instance of http://jabber.org/protocol/muc in the file?
[17:00:11] <Trev> no instance of that or jabber.org
[17:00:19] <MattJ> this is chat.js?
[17:00:36] <Trev> the closest line is: var x = Strophe.xmlElement("x", [["xmlns", Strophe.NS.MUC]]);
[17:00:44] <MattJ> Aha!
[17:00:53] <Trev> Yes, chat.js
[17:00:58] <MattJ> Ok, so they abstracted that - that's the line you want
[17:01:04] <MattJ> Change it to:
[17:01:12] <Trev> This is at the top: Speeqe.CHAT_MESSAGE_HISTORY = 1000;
[17:01:27] <MattJ> is that used anywhere?
[17:01:37] <MattJ> it should be used in that line if any :/
[17:01:46] <Trev> while (this._messages.length > Speeqe.CHAT_MESSAGE_HISTORY) { this._messages.splice(0,1); }
[17:02:00] <MattJ> /me bangs head on desk
[17:02:11] <Trev> this._nick = this._nick.replace("@"+Speeqe.XMPP_DOMAIN,""); /CHAT_MESSAGE_HISTORY
[17:02:45] <MattJ> Ok, we'll ignore that setting for now, it's nothing like what you want :)
[17:02:56] <Trev> Alright
[17:03:12] <Trev> So back to that original line?
[17:03:15] <MattJ> So the NS.MUC line, yes
[17:03:26] <MattJ> there's likely multiple, you want the one that's in a 'join' function
[17:03:35] <MattJ> which begins: join: function ()
[17:03:47] <MattJ> and my version has a comment: //join a multi user chat room by sending presence to the room
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[17:04:15] <MattJ> So assuming you have the right line then, change it to:
[17:04:23] <MattJ> var x = Strophe.xmlElement("x", [["xmlns", Strophe.NS.MUC], ["seconds", "300"]]);
[17:04:33] <MattJ> where 300 is whatever value you like
[17:04:46] <MattJ> That's all, just save the file and clear your browser's cache
[17:05:04] <MattJ> Gah, I didn't read, that's not all :)
[17:05:23] <MattJ> /me hides in shame
[17:05:29] <Trev> Hmm, okay, that line is found in the setTopic: function(topic) { and in an if(Speeqe.ENABLE_NICK)
[17:05:45] <Trev> Don't hide in shame, I feel stupid for not getting this!
[17:06:03] <MattJ> Could you pastebin your chat.js? It would be quicker
[17:06:12] <Trev> Sure, hang on.
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[17:08:35] <Trev> http://pastebin.com/pXPbDiYv
[17:09:06] <Trev> line 315 is where I found it.
[17:09:25] <MattJ> Line 28 is the one you want
[17:09:33] <MattJ> I'll make the changes, they're a few lines
[17:09:38] <Trev> Okay./
[17:09:54] <Trev> Oh, yeah. that line too.
[17:09:58] <Trev> :-p
[17:10:26] <Trev> Thanks for all your help, seriously. I'd still be banging my head on it.
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[17:17:46] <MattJ> Trev, try http://pastebin.com/EyZKzkDS
[17:18:05] <MattJ> Just those two highlighted blocks added
[17:20:14] <Trev> Okay.
[17:21:33] <Trev> Yeah, it works. How long is 300?
[17:21:39] <Trev> seconds, yes?
[17:21:41] <MattJ> 300 seconds, 5 minutes
[17:22:46] <Trev> Sweet. Thanks so much! it seems to work now.
[17:26:15] <Trev> Yep, works. Thanks, so much for all your help. it's the only thing I needed to fix after getting it running. :0)
[17:31:21] <MattJ> You're welcome :)
[17:36:39] <stpeter> MattJ rocks!
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[17:38:52] <Trev> I hate when bosses are like, oh wait, I want this too.
[17:39:01] <stpeter> heh
[17:39:13] <MattJ> :)
[17:39:23] <stpeter> MattJ solves that by not having a boss :)
[17:39:38] <Trev> Well, I suppose it depends which job I'm at.
[17:40:04] <Trev> I'm a teaching assistant, it employee, self-employed web developer and designer, and student. :-p
[17:40:11] <bush6474> Hi . Can you tell me how to retrieve a the history of a chat that took place earlier today but has seen be logged out of and back into?
[17:40:17] <bush6474> matt
[17:40:59] <MattJ> stpeter, it seems these good days may be at an end for a while :)
[17:41:56] <MattJ> bush6474, if it's no longer in the server's history cache then there's no defined way to do it over XMPP (yet)
[17:42:35] <bush6474> thank you sir. I'll have to you good old pots to get info this time.
[17:42:36] <stpeter> MattJ: ah, I didn't know -- do feel free to PM if needed or desired :)
[17:42:47] <MattJ> am doing so :)
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[17:45:26] <Trev> thanks again.
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[18:16:00] <Vanaryon> Hello !
[18:17:59] <Vanaryon> I just wanted to know if someone has ever heard of a PHP-based BOSH script
[18:18:28] <Vanaryon> I mean, not the PHP-to-BOSH libraries, but a real PHP based BOSH server ?
[18:19:13] <MattJ> Out of curiousity, what for?
[18:19:23] <Vanaryon> MattJ, for Jappix ;)
[18:19:34] <Vanaryon> For basic users it's easier to install
[18:19:46] <Tobias> they have a company policy that you have to use PHP ;)
[18:20:41] <MattJ> Oh I see...
[18:21:38] <Vanaryon> MattJ, advanced users will be able to use their internal XMPP server bosh ;)
[18:21:48] <Vanaryon> But basic users don't even know what "BOSH" is ;)
[18:22:14] <Vanaryon> And that's quite normal, so we must help them install it in a really simple way
[18:22:36] <MattJ> I think it's generally simpler to use the server's own BOSH, setting up an external one securely is more work
[18:23:58] <Vanaryon> But the user have to know what's the path to it is
[18:24:27] <Vanaryon> http://bind.jappix.com/ -> we cannot continue using our BOSH as a default :P
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[18:24:52] <Vanaryon> We will need a entire server for BOSH if it continues :P
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[18:25:38] <MattJ> If you set up an external one though then: 1) the user has to configure it to restrict it to their domain 2) the user has to actually start a long-running PHP process
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[18:28:01] <Trev> Hi, it's Trev again, I have another question when you got a moment.
[18:29:19] <Trev> Wondering if I have to set access rules for each virtual host / server.
[18:29:54] <MattJ> In ejabberd?
[18:30:56] <Trev> Yeah.
[18:31:19] <MattJ> I guess you do, but I'm afraid I'm no expert at that part of ejabberd - too long since I used it
[18:31:43] <Trev> Cause "admin" has it's own set, which I think are used by speeqe itself.
[18:32:02] <Trev> But I can't seem to connect from say Pidgin.
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[18:35:02] <Trev> I get a "remote server not found" 404 so weird.
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[18:37:11] <Trev> MattJ, fair enough, thanks. :)
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[18:48:22] <Trev> Whoa, that's interesting. If I'm a registered user, I can use pidgin. If I'm just an anonymous user looking for a random name, I cannot connect.
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[20:42:52] <bat> hi i am new to jabber. I am interested in making chatroom for my website, and wonder is it possible to make a room that remmeber setting and the Owner/Admin/Moderator like ChanServ in IRC? or is there a wiki i should read?.
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[20:44:40] <naw> bat:you can create a room just joining it
[20:44:51] <naw> then you will be able to configure it and make it permanent
[20:45:22] <naw> you also may be interested in web clients so your users will be able to join through the webpage
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[20:46:58] <bat> naw, i tried once~ but after i rejoin the room i lost the Owner right :<
[20:47:54] <naw> bat: did you joined with the same account that was used to create the room?
[20:48:04] <naw> if so, it's strange
[20:49:53] <bat> oh i mean the moderator right
[20:50:18] <naw> owners always are moderators
[20:51:26] <bat> so i have to set others to moderators everytime they join ?
[20:52:29] <naw> no, add them to the admin (or the owner) list
[20:53:20] <naw> then, everytime they join they will be moderators
[20:53:58] <bat> naw: with /affiliate ? this is what i got "Unable to affiliate user xxx as "admin"
[20:55:35] <naw> if the nickname doesn't work, try with his/her jabber id (user@server)
[20:55:46] <naw> be sure that you are owner of the room
[21:00:14] <bat> yay!
[21:00:22] <bat> thanks ^^
[21:01:49] <bat> one last thing, can you recommend a good web clinet?
[21:01:56] <bat> client*
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[21:02:16] <naw> a full client or one only for rooms?
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[21:03:33] <bat> for rooms
[21:03:35] <naw> with "only for rooms" I mean one that allows just to join rooms, without the user being able to create his/her own account, without roster (contact list )
[21:03:52] <naw> I know speeqe and muckl
[21:03:54] <naw> maybe there are more
[21:04:18] <bat> thanks i will look them up ^^
[21:04:49] <naw> if you want to take a look to this room through speeqe, http://speeqe.com/room/jabber@conference.jabber.org/
[21:05:36] <naw> you also should be able to download both and install them on your server
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